Third Time the Charm Carb Replace? Or Something Else?

[Girl In Big Truck]

So, I will be as specific as I can, Forgive if too specific, just want to make sure whomever reads catches this all.

Once upon a time, well starting a week ago, I started some over due parts replacements, still more to go. Got all the fluids changed (oil, tranny, diff) and got dual exhaust put in with two glass pack thrush mufflers. Sounding good, getting better.

I also finally decided to get a rebuilt carb and swap that out. Did that last Friday (a week from this post). The rebuilt carb was defective. Had a gas leak out of top front (float chamber). I sealed it up, and was running but rough, and ordered the warranty replacement which I got this last Wednesday (back to that in a moment).

Then, this last Tuesday, when of course, I had somewhere to be in four hours, I decided I would replace the distributor. No big deal, it's just a distributor, right?

Of course though, it all went to hell. I didn't get it in all the way, and got it out of timing. After finding TDC, finally, it starting running really well. More than well. Except, I was still worried about a sound I heard while finally getting the distributor back in right, like a tool dropping inside the engine. Regardless sounded awsome, needed the distributor. Turned the trucl off, got ready to where I needed to go, and after starting the truck, had that sound as if I was low on oil, and oil pressure gauge was down. Needless to say, the oil pump drive shaft fell into the oil pan.

Ok, So, Wednesday, I decided I would tackle some other things and then get onto the oil pump on Thursday. So Wednesday I put in new valve cover gaskets, a new master cylinder, and switched to carb number two, hoping not also defective (rebuilt 2 barrels, both, but each a little different). Keep in mind, was running with other leaky carb, new distributor, and even with oil pump drive shaft in oil pan.

Today, Thursday, I tackled the oil pump. Got the engine jacked up (with a little help), got the oil pan off cleaned up, new oil pump, pump drive shaft, and all gaskets in. New oil filter, oil, and coolant. (two oil changes in a week).

Now, it will not start, but, it turns over, and over, and over. Cranking, and cranking, with that new battery. But won't start. Carb is feeding gas, all parts moving as they should, but not a single attempt at firing off.

I am guessing faulty carb number two (would be my luck). The only thing different on this carb and the original motorcraft that was in there, is this one has an electric choke. I connected the choke to the positive ignition coil terminal. All vacuum hoses connected as should be and as was on original and last carb, all correct.

What am I missing here? Distributor is in line and works, and was running with truck, so can't be out of timing again, haven't touched it since. Plugs, wires, and other elec connectors as before, nothing else changed. I am thinking about just getting a holly or edelbrock tomorrow and returning this carb as well. But before I do, want to see if there is anything I might have missed.

I will check back in the morning and see what kind of responses I get. At least the truck is getting a good partial overhaul. Would like to drive soon though, my hands hurt from working on it for the last few days.

 

[Big Jim F150]

Check your Duraspatk II control module which is on the drivers side inner fender, for they can go bad, and also check your ignition coil, and the pickup wheel in your distributor, that's what was wrong with my 78 F-150 when it wouldn't start for I have a GM style HEI distributor or my truck, and also check your wiring for pinched or broken wires as well as shorts in your wiring. Just take your time and be patient with it and don't give up, you'll get it figured out.

 

[T64Mech]

Electric choke needs to be connected to the alternator (I believe the FIELD connection) and not the coil.

 

[No704]

Change too much at once !! Go back to orig dizz ...

 

[john112deere]

Start simple- any chance anything got unhooked/knocked loose when you were doing the oil pump?

 

[Fellro]

With the electric choke hooked to the ignition coil wire, you are grounding out the signal that charges the coil and lets it fire. It needs to go to a a wire that is powered when the key is on, but not the actual ignition wire.

 

[fatherdoug]

You might try spraying some starter fluid into the top of the carburetor to see if the engine runs momentarily. If the engine runs, then the problem would point to no, or inadequate, fuel flow.

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

In reply to responses: carb is getting gas, when I look in there and pull the accelerator, it is squirting fuel, distributor is new and was in perfect time three days ago running good, haven't touched since, I checked for any thing knocked loose, all intact.

As far as the electric choke, I unhooked from ignition coil, same thing. The coil is also new, and ran with it fine a few days ago. I don't think the coil would go bad that fast. And the choke should not have anything to do with the pistons firing off. It should start and if choke problem, would just not run right, or die.

I am going to replace plugs and wires (though only four or five months old) to rule that out, and the alternator, to rule that out as well, though there is power, it turns over, and the battery level is good (new battery).

After that, I am still suspecting the carburetor as the culprit. The first was defective, this one could have some issue as well, though it seem to be functioning as it should, getting fuel and air.

Question: would putting the new oil pump drive shaft in do anything weird to the distributor? Did not touch distributor during the oil pump process, just tapped the pump drive shaft into place. (I definitely don't want to have the pump drive shaft fall into the oil pan again. No please...)

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

Oh, and on first comment, don't think there is a control module on this one. Has one wire from distributor to ignition coil (once again, both new and running fine a few days ago), not the other distributor with the connector. And nothing on drivers side fender. A couple of small boxes with wires on passenger side, but those don't look like the control module.

I will try to get pics if I don't figure this out, several things are different than what usually shows up for parts on this truck. Engine may have been swapped at some point, but it is an early 70's engine, between 70 and 74.

Check your Duraspatk II control module which is on the drivers side inner fender, for they can go bad, and also check your ignition coil, and the pickup wheel in your distributor, that's what was wrong with my 78 F-150 when it wouldn't start for I have a GM style HEI distributor or my truck, and also check your wiring for pinched or broken wires as well as shorts in your wiring. Just take your time and be patient with it and don't give up, you'll get it figured out.

 

[bucks77ford]

Still sounds like you are not getting spark. Have you checked that since a few days ago? Even though things had ran fine but don't now, doesn't mean you are still getting spark. I have had the same things happen and come to find out a wire became pinched or not hooked up properly after doing some work. Verify you have good spark.

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

Still sounds like you are not getting spark. Have you checked that since a few days ago? Even though things had ran fine but don't now, doesn't mean you are still getting spark. I have had the same things happen and come to find out a wire became pinched or not hooked up properly after doing some work. Verify you have good spark.

Yep, doing that in a little while, going to get new plugs, wires, and alternator. Though alt has been running fine, looks as old as the truck.

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

Some Current Pics

Here is some pics around engine compartment, not that it helps. Choke is unplugged in pic, so I know about that.

 

[Fellro]

You have a points type distributor, so that opens a different angle...

 

[No704]

Sounds like you may be 180' out on the spark. Make sure it's firing on the compression stroke.

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

Sounds like you may be 180' out on the spark. Make sure it's firing on the compression stroke.

So I need to turn the distributor a bit?

UPDATE TO ALL THIS:

This morning I changed the plugs wires and alternator, and still the same thing. I was still not sure about the carb though.

So this afternoon I returned it and got an edelbrock. I installed it (removed the EGR valve and EGR spacer as well), change fuel hoses, plugged up a couple of vacuum ports, and....

SHE STARTED RIGHT UP!

Ok, so not over yet. Everything is running even better now. Turned her off and restarted three times, making a few minor adjustments.

The forth time I tried to start her, same thing as before. Won't start or fire, just turns over and over.

So that's my update. I am calling it a night and will get back on it tomorrow.

I will check on the compression stroke as mentioned in last message as well. Also wondering if there is anything going on with a clutch switch? Neutral safety switch? But this is manual 4 speed, not for sure if it has one, but know the clutch has to be in to start.

Also want to make sure I have the electric choke on the edelbrock hooked up right for positive. This is a nice carb and this truck sounds sick now. Want to make sure I have that hooked up right. (negative is to carb body as specified), positive is to what I think is the starter relay (bunch of wire going to and from it, one of pics in last response) on the blk/red term according to elec diagram, goes to alternator. FYI, I am going by the installation directions for the carb, edelbrock says DO NOT connect positive choke term to alt or ignition coil, but to running ignition power source, of course I have heard everything on choke connection....

 

[T64Mech]

Manual tranny will not have a neutral start safety switch. As for your no start issue, look at the dizzy gear and see if you sheared the drive gear pin. Your dizzy may have slipped and rotated enough that your timing is off. What adjustments did you make, this may have affected your no start issue as well.

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

Manual tranny will not have a neutral start safety switch. As for your no start issue, look at the dizzy gear and see if you sheared the drive gear pin. Your dizzy may have slipped and rotated enough that your timing is off. What adjustments did you make, this may have affected your no start issue as well.

Morning... in order of everything done within last week:

1. dual exhaust, mufflers, battery, all fluids changed, distributor (with TDC adjustment), and carb switch #1
   
2. running after this but oil pump drive shaft fell into oil pan and carb #1 (reman) was leaking gas
   
3. replaced oil pump, oil pump drive shaft, oil pan gasket, second oil change, master cylinder, and carb #2 (reman)
   
4. no start, just turning over
   
5. new wires, plugs, alternator, and oil pressure sensor
   
6. still no start, turning over though
   
7. returned carb #2 (reman) and got carb #3 (edelbrock), replaced gas lines in engine compartment, ditched EGR valve and EGR spacer
   
8. started right up
   
9. let run for 15, turned off, made minor carb adjustments, started right up again, let run, turned off, started right up third time, turned off
   
10. forth time starting wont start, doing same thing, just turning over

I agree with timing off on distributor, or still perhaps a short somewhere? Also need to make sure I have the elec choke hooked up right. Real close though. Was running awesome last night for that 30 minutes, but was idling pretty high, and the edelbrock idle screw was already preset down pretty far. (distributor timing again?)

 

[dustybumpers]

Sounds like your coil is bad, try using the old coil.

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

Everything is (WAS) running fine, was timing. Now another problem.

Replaced starter, and grinds while running, have to shut of immediately.

Going to take it off and get another, compare it to an older model since first distributor was wrong. Don't want to mess up the flywheel.

What a nightmare...

 

[Girl In Big Truck]

All working good now. Seven days of continuous work and struggle. Starter issue solved by installing a starter shim. Still needs some minor tuning on carburetor and timing, but running, and running better than ever. Had one issue when I stopped for gas, turned key off and pulled key out, and realized the truck was still running. But only did it that once, I made several stops today and all went well. Worth the struggle, now I have a fairly decent partial overhaul of parts.

• All fluids changed.
• New exhaust.
• Valve cover gaskets.
• Distributor, Cap, and Rotor.
• Ignition Coil.
• Carburetor.
• Alternator.
• Battery.
• Starter.
• Starter wire.
• Oil Pump.
• Oil Pump Drive Shaft.
• Oil Pan Gasket.
• Voltage Regulator.
• Starter Relay.
• Rewired Alternator Harness (and learned not to put the wires on backwards or you drain the battery).
• Fuel Lines In Engine Compartment.
• Master Cylinder.
• Plugs and Wires.
• Replaced All Clearance and Turn Signal Bulbs (all were really old).

I think I left out a few things I did, too tired to remember. Many other parts I previously replaced and are still good (belts, fuel filter, water pump, thermostat).

Hopefully no more major work for awhile.