LS in dentsides

[blackhat620]

Again Greg...thanks for the input. I just didn't know if a LS front would help with streetability...but once I get the '96 back in my possession, that will be the DD, and the Bronco will be relegated to 'fun duty' once again. So f/r selectable lockers it is...got a lead on a rear sterling 10.5...so I'll probably go that route, now that I think about it...and there's a guy I know with several '79 HPD60's...and that'll probably go up front. So much to do...so little time....and money. I'm one of those guys that likes to do it all at once, so this probably won't happen til the summer...just gaining ideas and expertise in the mean time. So thanks again for all the valuable input.

Ben,

Since you will need an air source for an ARB selectable locker, your best choice would be to mount a York compressor. The York will give you plenty of air on the trail to air up your tires after off roading, also can be used to run air horns and small air tools. Here are some links to the install.
www.projectresponder.com/onboard-air~38.htm
www.rockcrawler.com/techreports/york_tj/part1/index.htm
www.coloradok5.com/york.shtml
www.jedi.com/obiwan/jeep/yorkair.html
http://broncoair.com/broncoyorkair.html

If you do not want to go with a York system then i would recomend a high output electric pump such as Vivair or ExtremeAire
www.viaircorp.com
www.extremeoutback.com/index.cgi?exact_match=yes&product=Air Compressors&cart_id=3623352.4424

I do not like the ARB compressors as they are overpriced for what you get.

 

[LEB Ben]

Again...many thanks, I was wanting to go that route, and was going to be my next question/thread, but you beat me it.

 

[TexasNomad]

Those are really cool, but how reliable are they? also Ben you have to think about the extra maintenance, air leaks and what happens if the air line gets ripped off..

 

[LEB Ben]

Those are really cool, but how reliable are they? also Ben you have to think about the extra maintenance, air leaks and what happens if the air line gets ripped off..

Yeah but that would just be assumed under routine maintainance...as comes with any upgrades. Not really worried about it, I believe the extra functionality will faaaaaaaaaaar outweigh the extra maintainance to persuade me to not have it at all.

 

[Skandocious]

One of the guys on the snow trip did a York swap-- I aired my tires back up with it when were got back to dry road. It was pretty wicked-- but it replaced his A/C compressor.

I was talking to Rick about it and he said there are special brackets that you can mount the york in tandem with the A/C compressor and run a 2nd belt from the york to a special pulley on the power steering. Seems to me that THAT would be the trick setup.

 

[1985 Ford F-150]

But it robs the power quite a bit especially if ya have a sb or six.

 

[Skandocious]

I don't know much about OBA-- but my basic understanding is that it has some sort of clutch, like the A/C compressor, that disengages when it's not in use. The proper setup would have an on-board air tank, which would be filled with compressed air, ready to use. Then when the tank starts to lose pressure from being used, the clutch would engage and refill the tank. This is the setup that the guy had when we went to the snow.

If the compressor was running all the time then the damned tank would explode, lol.

 

[1985 Ford F-150]

Yeah I figured it would be somethin like that. The main reason I dont run air on my truck is cause ya gotta find a place for the tanks and ya gotta drain em out and then ya gotta figure out how to run the lines so they wont get hurt and mount the compressor and wire it all in. It just seems like alot of hassle to me. I think they make electronicly controlled lockers but im not sure, thats the way I would go if I was gettin a locker.

 

[LEB Ben]

All good points Dan...but the plans for the Bronco are to turn it into trail use only. So it's not like it's gonna be the hassle it would be on a DD. On top of that, I wanted to be able to run air tools and whatnot, so I think this would be waaaaaay more valuable than a hinderance.

 

[Skandocious]

They do make electrical lockers. Eaton has 1 or 2... Here's an example:

http://www.eaton.com/EatonCom/Produ...ucts/Products/Differentials/Elocker/index.htm


For heavy offroad-- ARB air lockers are the cream of the crop.

 

[Blue Bomber]

X2 the ONLY bad thing ive seen is the air lines are a wee bit fragile. i cool tip i saw was to run the lines that come with the kit through some clear aquarium air lines (like the kind that airate the tank and make bubbles). it seems to add a bit of strength and protection to them.

 

[blackhat620]

Those are really cool, but how reliable are they? also Ben you have to think about the extra maintenance, air leaks and what happens if the air line gets ripped off..

The York compressors are very reliable, as are the "good" electric ones. The York compressor mod has been used by the hardcore off roader for years. The ARB air lockers have been proven for years. If you get and air leak or hose torn loose on the trail, then the diff reverts back to an "open" diff. So the only loss with an air leak is you do not have the ability to lock the axle until you get the leak fixed. There is no additional maintenance for an Air Locker than a standard open diff. However, there are no free rides, everything breaks and has its limits, but if you do a clean install and properly maintain your vehicle a selectable locker is far superior to any of the alternatives.

 

[blackhat620]

I don't know much about OBA-- but my basic understanding is that it has some sort of clutch, like the A/C compressor, that disengages when it's not in use. The proper setup would have an on-board air tank, which would be filled with compressed air, ready to use. Then when the tank starts to lose pressure from being used, the clutch would engage and refill the tank. This is the setup that the guy had when we went to the snow.

Exactly, the compressor clutch is only engaged when needed, and the system has start & stop pressure relays just like your home compressor.

Yeah I figured it would be somethin like that. The main reason I dont run air on my truck is cause ya gotta find a place for the tanks and ya gotta drain em out and then ya gotta figure out how to run the lines so they wont get hurt and mount the compressor and wire it all in. It just seems like alot of hassle to me. I think they make electronicly controlled lockers but im not sure, thats the way I would go if I was gettin a locker.

Tanks and electric compressors can be mounted on the frame rails, run wiring and air lines along the frame rails as well. The air lines are run along the tops of the axles (as would be electric lines if it was an electric locker). You can install automatic drains in the tanks if you do not want to manually drain them.

X2 the ONLY bad thing ive seen is the air lines are a wee bit fragile. i cool tip i saw was to run the lines that come with the kit through some clear aquarium air lines (like the kind that airate the tank and make bubbles). it seems to add a bit of strength and protection to them.

You can also run the air lines with SS tubing and just use a short flex piece were needed.

If you are using an air locker or and e-locker (they also make manual cable actuated lockers, "OX Locker"), the lines must be run on top of the axles for the most protection. If you rip the lines loose you are in some serious conditions and useually will break something else first.

Some guys will install the York compressor in place of there AC system because there dedicated rig does not need AC. The other option is to install the York system in addition to your other components. You can fab your own brackets or purchase them pre-made. Look at the links i posted for clean installs, there are many more write ups on the web.

E-lockers are available, but there application availability is limited. ARB air lockers fit most every application and they have been proven in extreme conditions for years.

 

[TexasNomad]

I am including some more links with additional information on the Torsen and also TrueTrac (Gear type). Note both the TrueTrac & Torsen LS units are torque sensitive gear units and are similar in operation. The Torsen units are a newer design than the TrueTrac, and there are different model choices depending on the application.

FYI most all LS units are "Torque Sensing", whereas Lockers (ie Detroit) are "Speed Sensitive". (There are some "Speed Sensitive" LS units but they are not very effective and are in limited use).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torsen
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_slip_differential
www.torsen.com/general/general_faq.htm
www.torsen.com/files/Traction_Control_Article.pdf
www.4crawler.com/4x4/TrueTrac.shtml
www.4xreview.com/Reviews/ProductReviews/Drivetrain/TractechTrueTrac/tabid/313/Default.aspx


There is nothing wrong with running an "Automatic Locker" (ie Detroit), depending on the use of the vehicle, but understand that all types of differentials (open, LS, Auto Locker) have there strengths and weaknesses depending on the application.

For a daily driver and Auto Locker is noisy and imparts increased stresses on the axles and driveshaft. The advantage of a locker is that both wheels will be locked together on an axle even if one wheel is in the air. An auto locker is a great disadvantage on the street in slick conditions as it can cause unpredictable handling do to the automatic nature of locking and unlocking. Auto lockers are not used in front axles on the street do to steering difficulties. Also lockers are more difficult the shorter the wheelbase of street vehicles. Auto lockers should not be used when towing or hauling heavy loads on the street as it can cause broken axles, drivelines etc.

An LS unit has much better road manners than an Auto Locker, and the Gear type LS units are almost as good as a locker for the normal user. Note lockers are needed for rock crawlers.

The best of both worlds is a "Selectable Locker" (ARB Air Locker etc) as they are normally an Open Diff until the switch is thrown by the driver Locking both wheels together on the same axle. Note "Selectable Lockers" are switched off to turn etc. When a selectable locker is locked it is just like a spool.

For front axles either an LS or Selectable locker is your best choice, Automatic lockers are a bad choice in a street driven vehicle.

So this would be the best type for a daily driver then BlackHat?
http://broncograveyard.com/bronco/i-12334_9__detroit_truetrac_differential_complete.htm

 

[blackhat620]

So this would be the best type for a daily driver then BlackHat?
http://broncograveyard.com/bronco/i-12334_9__detroit_truetrac_differential_complete.htm

Tex,

If you are going to install an LS in the rear axle of your DD, then yes IMHO the best LS on the market is the gear type, ie the True Trac you have in your link.

 

[TexasNomad]

Shaaaaweet!
Thanks BH