Fordzilla80
Ranger Lariat
Good luck Travis.Hope ya get her fixed.
I think your trucks just throwin a fit cause you ain't cleanin the windshield on it.
I think your trucks just throwin a fit cause you ain't cleanin the windshield on it.
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misfire/skip help
- Thread starter89frankenford
- Start date
mrfixit
Chief Chaotic Engineer
sounding more like the map sensor with each post, lol...
I drove her like that from KC to Joplin- 170 miles @ 4 mpg!
Umm, nope, MAP won't make it smoke like a freight train, but a failed fuel pressure regulator WILL, and you WILL have a severe loss of power due to flooding. Injector failures are pretty rare as compared to FPR failures. Been there, done that, TWICE, and did NOT get a t-shirt. 30 minute job to swap the FPR. You'll see it quick enough if you put the pressure gauge on it. Fix it soon, because you're washing the rings on 3, 4, 7, and 8. The simplest check for a failed (badly failed) FPR is to pull the vacuum line on the FPR, and cycle the ignition switch a couple times. If fuel comes out that connection, you definitely have a DOA FPR.
For the most part, if the MAP is failed, IF it runs, it won't run long because there's nothing to sense stall conditions. My 5.0 won't even start with the vacuum line disconnected from the MAP. MAP will affect fuel/air mix and timing, but the truck should simply go into limp mode, and will certainly throw a code and turn on the CEL. However, it will not let enough fuel through the injectors to make it smoke significantly. It will run rich, but not that rich. If you've got lots of black smoke, I'd suspect the FPR first. A lot easier to change that than the injectors, especially on a 5.0.
Above all, pull the codes. Easy to do with a paper clip (see www.fordfuelinjection.com). Didn't notice what model yours is, but if it's post '88, the CEL will blink the diagnostic codes at you. For the KOEO, put the paper clip in the DCL, sit behind the wheel, and turn on the ignition. After the self-test, it will blink an engine code at you (2, 3 or 4 blinks for 4, 6, or 8 cylinders) Then, it will blink on for about a half second, and off for half second for each digit in the code. Don't know whether you have three digit codes, or two digit. There should be about a 2-3 second pause between each digit, and a very quick blink (watch closely) between each code. When it stops blinking, test is done. The CEL can also be tested by pressing the accelerator to the floor. That will alternately turn it on and off each time you floor it. (OBVIOUSLY you don't want to try to check the light with the engine running). If you miss a count, no worries. Simply let the test finish, then restart it. The stored codes will only be erased under two conditions. 1, if you interrupt the test by removing the paper clip from the DCL, that will reset the codes. 2, if you disconnect the negative lead on the batter for at least 10 minutes, that too will erase the codes. The difference in the two is that the first option does not require re-learning the fuel/air curves. Chances are it wouldn't hurt to do that anyway, depending on how long you've been driving it with a leaking FPR. My guess is, all the tables are extremely lean due to trying to compensate for the excess fuel.
When you get the fuel pressure gauge, the test is relatively simple.
Test 1. Connect gauge. Turn on key and wait for pump to stop. Fuel rail should be partially charged, but maybe not to full pressure. The ECM only cycles the pump to test the relay and make sure power is sent to the pump(s). I normally saw about 50% of required operating pressure. The fuel pump will not run again until the ECM detects a steady input from the PIP in the dizzy, i.e. after the engine starts.
Test 2. Pin 6 of the DCL, when grounded, will let you run the fuel pump at will. That bypasses the fuel pump relay output from the ECM. You WILL get a code for doing this, but you generated the code, so don't be alarmed. This will allow you to check fuel pressure at WOT conditions, i.e. no vacuum on the intake.
Test 3. In addition to your fuel pressure gauge, I suggest a small hand-held vacuum pump. You can connect that to the FPR to simulate idle conditions, to make sure that the FPR is decreasing pressure when the engine is idling. Pull the vacuum to about 20 inches, and it should reduce the pressure. Release the vacuum slowly to make sure the output pressure increases as vacuum decreases. Obviously, the fuel pump needs to be running the whole time you are doing this. Won't hurt it a bit. That's what it does when the engine is running. DO NOT DO THIS TEST WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING. Too many get it backward that the vacuum is high when the throttle is open. No, it isn't. Exactly the opposite. Open throttle = air flow into the intake = lower vacuum. The vacuum pump can also be used to test the MAP, to bleed brakes, and a host of other uses.
MAP sensors simply don't fail very often. They're a bit pricy if you get a genuine Motorcraft part too, and I wouldn't run any other brand on my truck, nor either of my '86 Birds. That's 3 SD systems, and NEVER a MAP sensor failure on two cars that are 26 years old, and a truck that is 17 years old. I did buy one when I was chasing a different problem, but the new one is back in the box on a shelf in my garage. The plastic tubing CAN split, but only if someone's been monkeying with it trying to bend it in places it wasn't meant to bend. Certainly, check the tubing and the connecting hoses to make sure nothing is split or dry rotted. The Birds have the MAP mounted far away on a fender, and even have a small accumulator to minimize the pulsing from the intake and smooth the signal from the MAP, so apparently some filtering won't hurt the MAP. And YES, the MAPs are interchangeable between the 3.8L V6 and the 5.0L V8. Number of cylinders has NOTHING to do with the function of the MAP. There is NO difference. I even tested that theory by swapping the one from my blue bird into my truck (after determining it was not the problem).
Check that FPR for leaks before you start throwing other parts at it. It's a non-invasive test, and EASY to do. Fuel on the nipple or in the tube to the intake means it's definitely failed. NO FUEL should go through that tube. It's hard to see back behind the plenum if you have the 5.0, but still, only three screws (Allen head, and metric) to pop it out and put a new one it. IIRC, about $12 for the part when I did it.
There is actually another test which requires a little intestinal fortitude. The ones listed above are the safest. Push the accelerator pedal to the floor, and try to start the engine. It SHOULD NOT start regardless of how well the starter is turning it over, because the ECM will not fire the injectors with WOT condition during start mode. If it does start, first things first, take your foot off the accelerator pedal, or you're liable to have a high-speed comeapart on that engine. That indicates fuel is getting there when it should NOT. Only way that can happen is through the FPR, or through a leaking injector. This test only proves fuel is getting in, not WHERE it's coming from. This test is good for finding bad FPR, bad injector(s), or bad TPS, but you won't know which until you do some more testing. It's just a catch-all fuel delivery test.
Good luck, hope you find the problem.
For the most part, if the MAP is failed, IF it runs, it won't run long because there's nothing to sense stall conditions. My 5.0 won't even start with the vacuum line disconnected from the MAP. MAP will affect fuel/air mix and timing, but the truck should simply go into limp mode, and will certainly throw a code and turn on the CEL. However, it will not let enough fuel through the injectors to make it smoke significantly. It will run rich, but not that rich. If you've got lots of black smoke, I'd suspect the FPR first. A lot easier to change that than the injectors, especially on a 5.0.
Above all, pull the codes. Easy to do with a paper clip (see www.fordfuelinjection.com). Didn't notice what model yours is, but if it's post '88, the CEL will blink the diagnostic codes at you. For the KOEO, put the paper clip in the DCL, sit behind the wheel, and turn on the ignition. After the self-test, it will blink an engine code at you (2, 3 or 4 blinks for 4, 6, or 8 cylinders) Then, it will blink on for about a half second, and off for half second for each digit in the code. Don't know whether you have three digit codes, or two digit. There should be about a 2-3 second pause between each digit, and a very quick blink (watch closely) between each code. When it stops blinking, test is done. The CEL can also be tested by pressing the accelerator to the floor. That will alternately turn it on and off each time you floor it. (OBVIOUSLY you don't want to try to check the light with the engine running). If you miss a count, no worries. Simply let the test finish, then restart it. The stored codes will only be erased under two conditions. 1, if you interrupt the test by removing the paper clip from the DCL, that will reset the codes. 2, if you disconnect the negative lead on the batter for at least 10 minutes, that too will erase the codes. The difference in the two is that the first option does not require re-learning the fuel/air curves. Chances are it wouldn't hurt to do that anyway, depending on how long you've been driving it with a leaking FPR. My guess is, all the tables are extremely lean due to trying to compensate for the excess fuel.
When you get the fuel pressure gauge, the test is relatively simple.
Test 1. Connect gauge. Turn on key and wait for pump to stop. Fuel rail should be partially charged, but maybe not to full pressure. The ECM only cycles the pump to test the relay and make sure power is sent to the pump(s). I normally saw about 50% of required operating pressure. The fuel pump will not run again until the ECM detects a steady input from the PIP in the dizzy, i.e. after the engine starts.
Test 2. Pin 6 of the DCL, when grounded, will let you run the fuel pump at will. That bypasses the fuel pump relay output from the ECM. You WILL get a code for doing this, but you generated the code, so don't be alarmed. This will allow you to check fuel pressure at WOT conditions, i.e. no vacuum on the intake.
Test 3. In addition to your fuel pressure gauge, I suggest a small hand-held vacuum pump. You can connect that to the FPR to simulate idle conditions, to make sure that the FPR is decreasing pressure when the engine is idling. Pull the vacuum to about 20 inches, and it should reduce the pressure. Release the vacuum slowly to make sure the output pressure increases as vacuum decreases. Obviously, the fuel pump needs to be running the whole time you are doing this. Won't hurt it a bit. That's what it does when the engine is running. DO NOT DO THIS TEST WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING. Too many get it backward that the vacuum is high when the throttle is open. No, it isn't. Exactly the opposite. Open throttle = air flow into the intake = lower vacuum. The vacuum pump can also be used to test the MAP, to bleed brakes, and a host of other uses.
MAP sensors simply don't fail very often. They're a bit pricy if you get a genuine Motorcraft part too, and I wouldn't run any other brand on my truck, nor either of my '86 Birds. That's 3 SD systems, and NEVER a MAP sensor failure on two cars that are 26 years old, and a truck that is 17 years old. I did buy one when I was chasing a different problem, but the new one is back in the box on a shelf in my garage. The plastic tubing CAN split, but only if someone's been monkeying with it trying to bend it in places it wasn't meant to bend. Certainly, check the tubing and the connecting hoses to make sure nothing is split or dry rotted. The Birds have the MAP mounted far away on a fender, and even have a small accumulator to minimize the pulsing from the intake and smooth the signal from the MAP, so apparently some filtering won't hurt the MAP. And YES, the MAPs are interchangeable between the 3.8L V6 and the 5.0L V8. Number of cylinders has NOTHING to do with the function of the MAP. There is NO difference. I even tested that theory by swapping the one from my blue bird into my truck (after determining it was not the problem).
Check that FPR for leaks before you start throwing other parts at it. It's a non-invasive test, and EASY to do. Fuel on the nipple or in the tube to the intake means it's definitely failed. NO FUEL should go through that tube. It's hard to see back behind the plenum if you have the 5.0, but still, only three screws (Allen head, and metric) to pop it out and put a new one it. IIRC, about $12 for the part when I did it.
There is actually another test which requires a little intestinal fortitude. The ones listed above are the safest. Push the accelerator pedal to the floor, and try to start the engine. It SHOULD NOT start regardless of how well the starter is turning it over, because the ECM will not fire the injectors with WOT condition during start mode. If it does start, first things first, take your foot off the accelerator pedal, or you're liable to have a high-speed comeapart on that engine. That indicates fuel is getting there when it should NOT. Only way that can happen is through the FPR, or through a leaking injector. This test only proves fuel is getting in, not WHERE it's coming from. This test is good for finding bad FPR, bad injector(s), or bad TPS, but you won't know which until you do some more testing. It's just a catch-all fuel delivery test.
Good luck, hope you find the problem.
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
holy crap thats a lot of reading haha j/k
thanks for the info. i do know how to do a self test(done it many times on my truck
) i did check the FPR real quick yesterday by just pulling the vacuum line off after a long drive i took. there was no fuel or any moisture for that matter in or around the vacuum line or the FPR...granted that doesnt elimnate that possible problem but i do know its not pouring fuel into the lines by a bad diaphragm.
today i have been working on the truck..(im actually taking a break and letting the motor cool down right now) i bought a new TFI Module since mine is original and i had some major problems with it acting up a year ago then that stop(typical highway run going 65mph and then it would just shut off) im waiting for the engine to cool to remove the old one. im also going to recheck my timing again. i set it at at 12 degrees advanced for more performance back in march but then tuned it down in may when the problems started to happen because i wanted to find the problem first then change it back to 12. when i reset it i set it to stock 10 degrees advanced.
i also bought a new vacuum gauge tool as well as the new TFI module. my old one was tired and it was cheap enough. so when i get the module installed im going to recheck timing and make sure it is definitely on 10 degrees.
oh by the way i dont have the 5.0L i have the 4.9L so my cylinder #'s 7 and 8 can burn up and flood all they want haha
thanks for the info. i do know how to do a self test(done it many times on my truck
) i did check the FPR real quick yesterday by just pulling the vacuum line off after a long drive i took. there was no fuel or any moisture for that matter in or around the vacuum line or the FPR...granted that doesnt elimnate that possible problem but i do know its not pouring fuel into the lines by a bad diaphragm. today i have been working on the truck..(im actually taking a break and letting the motor cool down right now) i bought a new TFI Module since mine is original and i had some major problems with it acting up a year ago then that stop(typical highway run going 65mph and then it would just shut off) im waiting for the engine to cool to remove the old one. im also going to recheck my timing again. i set it at at 12 degrees advanced for more performance back in march but then tuned it down in may when the problems started to happen because i wanted to find the problem first then change it back to 12. when i reset it i set it to stock 10 degrees advanced.
i also bought a new vacuum gauge tool as well as the new TFI module. my old one was tired and it was cheap enough. so when i get the module installed im going to recheck timing and make sure it is definitely on 10 degrees.
oh by the way i dont have the 5.0L i have the 4.9L so my cylinder #'s 7 and 8 can burn up and flood all they want haha
Fordzilla80
Ranger Lariat
LOL..........................
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
ok update from my work on the truck today
i installed a new TFI Module today since mine was ORIGINAL!! from 1989! it was was an improvement on how it ran and i have a bit more power but it was NOT the main issue for my problem.
so i alos bought a new vacuum gauge since mines kind of old. i test a bunch of lines to make sure i have an equal vacuum across all lines. i first tested the manifold vacuum by hooking the gauge up to the manifold. i was getting about 21 In/Hg of vacuum.
here is a video of the gauge on the manifold and the response i have...
now just so you know i DON'T have a Vacuum reservoir so im assuming thats why my vacuum drops to zero when i hit the gas. im going to be getting a reservoir this week(or making one)
here is the vacuum reading right before the MAP Sensor.
here is the Vacuum reading right before the EGR Vacuum Control Solenoid
now this is what i found very interesting. i test the vacuum going to the vacuum control solenoid then say a line going from the solenoid to the EGR(this is normal) so i decided to test the vacuum going to the EGR from the solenoid. now at this point my truck is hot. its running at about 215 degrees(normal) now when i hooked up the gauge to the line going to the EGR i had NO vacuum at all....now when the engine is running and its hot shouldnt there be vacuum ?????
next i tested the vacuum at the fuel pressure regulator. the reading was normal 21 In/Hg
the last thing i tested was the vent control vacuum lines. they tested normal 21 In/Hg
so basically i havent found the problem but i have eliminated some aspects of the question. im assuming the vacuum i am getting is normal at 21 In/Hg. the TFI Module is new and working good. and i also retimed the truck as well. its set at 10 Degrees advanced.
now im just waiting for my Fuel Pressure gauge to come in so i can test the fuel pressure and the injectors. anything i can check?
i installed a new TFI Module today since mine was ORIGINAL!! from 1989! it was was an improvement on how it ran and i have a bit more power but it was NOT the main issue for my problem.
so i alos bought a new vacuum gauge since mines kind of old. i test a bunch of lines to make sure i have an equal vacuum across all lines. i first tested the manifold vacuum by hooking the gauge up to the manifold. i was getting about 21 In/Hg of vacuum.
here is a video of the gauge on the manifold and the response i have...
now just so you know i DON'T have a Vacuum reservoir so im assuming thats why my vacuum drops to zero when i hit the gas. im going to be getting a reservoir this week(or making one)
here is the vacuum reading right before the MAP Sensor.
here is the Vacuum reading right before the EGR Vacuum Control Solenoid
now this is what i found very interesting. i test the vacuum going to the vacuum control solenoid then say a line going from the solenoid to the EGR(this is normal) so i decided to test the vacuum going to the EGR from the solenoid. now at this point my truck is hot. its running at about 215 degrees(normal) now when i hooked up the gauge to the line going to the EGR i had NO vacuum at all....now when the engine is running and its hot shouldnt there be vacuum ?????
next i tested the vacuum at the fuel pressure regulator. the reading was normal 21 In/Hg
the last thing i tested was the vent control vacuum lines. they tested normal 21 In/Hg
so basically i havent found the problem but i have eliminated some aspects of the question. im assuming the vacuum i am getting is normal at 21 In/Hg. the TFI Module is new and working good. and i also retimed the truck as well. its set at 10 Degrees advanced.
now im just waiting for my Fuel Pressure gauge to come in so i can test the fuel pressure and the injectors. anything i can check?
Last edited:
flareside_thunder
Florida Chapter member
- 7,812
- 246
Uhhh, I thought gasoline engines didn't produce vacuum at higher RPM's, IE my AC kicks to defrost when I floor it because of a bad checkvalve. Check the FPR like Old Paint said.....and make sure you get the right one......there's a 3 bolt FPR and a 2 bolt. I'd also check voltage at the EGR solenoid and make sure it's getting power to it....if not then it may be a bad solenoid...or just not the right circumstances for it to produce vacuum.
Just noticed that you said the VRES wasn't there any more. That may also answer what's going on with the hesitation in the other thread. The VRES is IMPORTANT to sustain EGR position under mild throttle changes. EGR is open only above idle, and below WOT, and with the vehicle moving, under normal conditions and functioning ECM/PCV systems.
I'm gonna go out on a limb, and wonder what happens when there is no VRES when you're driving. I gotta believe that the ECM is getting confused about the A/F ratios it THINKS should be there, but with the EGR closing (due to loss of vacuum when the throttle opens), that would cause some rich indications, and may cause the ECM to over-react, cutting back the injector pulses, and causing lean mix hesitation. I.E., act like a carb that the accel pump diaphragm has failed on, as I described in the other thread.
Dunno, I may be fulla crap, though. VRES is there for a reason though. The one over on the right fender well is strictly for emissions gear (EGR, TAD/TAB) Should be a black line going to the VRES, a red one from there to the EGR/TAB/TAD valve header, a green to the EGR, and a tan one to the diverter valve. I think the last one is a yellow to the bypass valve. At least that's the set up on mine. Someone might want to check my color scheme, though. I did that from memory. The dampers in the HVAC systems and the Cruise Control each have their own reservoirs. On my '92 with 5.0, the VRES for the CC is mounted down low, on the left side. I think ALL models have the reservoir for the HVAC inside, and it's just a plastic ball. ALL of them should have a check valve between them and intake vacuum to prevent throttle changes from affecting the mix door in the HVAC and the cruise control, as well as making funky things happen when emissions equipment doesn't function right. (As a side note to the problems with the air/defrost flow diverter issues, check the little white tube that goes in through the evaporator housing. Those like to crack and leak.)
After all that, I'd suggest that the absence of VRES is possibly causing more problems than you realize. I know my truck ran like crap after a dealership punctured the can (yes, it can be done by the right idiot) trying to pry it off the fender liner. You don't even wanna know how much damage a dealer did in my engine bay. Suffice it to say, said dealer wound up replacing the VRES, a fender liner, and a half dozen vacuum lines to keep me from sending the photos to Ford Consumer Appeals.
I'm gonna go out on a limb, and wonder what happens when there is no VRES when you're driving. I gotta believe that the ECM is getting confused about the A/F ratios it THINKS should be there, but with the EGR closing (due to loss of vacuum when the throttle opens), that would cause some rich indications, and may cause the ECM to over-react, cutting back the injector pulses, and causing lean mix hesitation. I.E., act like a carb that the accel pump diaphragm has failed on, as I described in the other thread.
Dunno, I may be fulla crap, though. VRES is there for a reason though. The one over on the right fender well is strictly for emissions gear (EGR, TAD/TAB) Should be a black line going to the VRES, a red one from there to the EGR/TAB/TAD valve header, a green to the EGR, and a tan one to the diverter valve. I think the last one is a yellow to the bypass valve. At least that's the set up on mine. Someone might want to check my color scheme, though. I did that from memory. The dampers in the HVAC systems and the Cruise Control each have their own reservoirs. On my '92 with 5.0, the VRES for the CC is mounted down low, on the left side. I think ALL models have the reservoir for the HVAC inside, and it's just a plastic ball. ALL of them should have a check valve between them and intake vacuum to prevent throttle changes from affecting the mix door in the HVAC and the cruise control, as well as making funky things happen when emissions equipment doesn't function right. (As a side note to the problems with the air/defrost flow diverter issues, check the little white tube that goes in through the evaporator housing. Those like to crack and leak.)
After all that, I'd suggest that the absence of VRES is possibly causing more problems than you realize. I know my truck ran like crap after a dealership punctured the can (yes, it can be done by the right idiot) trying to pry it off the fender liner. You don't even wanna know how much damage a dealer did in my engine bay. Suffice it to say, said dealer wound up replacing the VRES, a fender liner, and a half dozen vacuum lines to keep me from sending the photos to Ford Consumer Appeals.
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89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
ok thanks a lot! i have actually replaced the VRES on the fender for the EGR solenoid. i did that i believe 2 days ago(score from the junkyard! haha i got it off of a 95 with only 38K ON IT AND RUST FREE!!...to bad the truck was stripped and laying on frame)
i have also replaced the vacuum lines going to the VRES from the manifold, the line going to the MAP, and the line going from the VRES to the EGR solenoid. after all the things i have done this past week(New TFI "Ignition" Module, re timed engine to 10 degrees BTDC, some new vacuum lines, new VRES, new EGR solenoid from the same 38K truck, cleaned the motor off mud, dirt and oil). i dont have a check valve between the VRES and the manifold though. after all that it is running better with a lot better pickup then before...but i do still have a small misfire/skip and the hesitation it still there.
overall has it improved sine the start of this thread? DEFINITELY YES! is the problem still lingering? yeah. like i said before im just waiting for my new fuel presure gauge to come in the mail so i can check the fuel pressure, and check to see if the injectors are clogged/not working. the fuel pressure regualtor appears to be fine from what i can tell but for the hell of it im going to get a new one next thursday. unfortunately i wont dont think i will be getting the new test gauge until next week..is there anything else i can check in the mean time?
OH BY THE WAY!!! THANKS AGAIN FOR THE HELP!!!!!!
i have also replaced the vacuum lines going to the VRES from the manifold, the line going to the MAP, and the line going from the VRES to the EGR solenoid. after all the things i have done this past week(New TFI "Ignition" Module, re timed engine to 10 degrees BTDC, some new vacuum lines, new VRES, new EGR solenoid from the same 38K truck, cleaned the motor off mud, dirt and oil). i dont have a check valve between the VRES and the manifold though. after all that it is running better with a lot better pickup then before...but i do still have a small misfire/skip and the hesitation it still there.
overall has it improved sine the start of this thread? DEFINITELY YES! is the problem still lingering? yeah. like i said before im just waiting for my new fuel presure gauge to come in the mail so i can check the fuel pressure, and check to see if the injectors are clogged/not working. the fuel pressure regualtor appears to be fine from what i can tell but for the hell of it im going to get a new one next thursday. unfortunately i wont dont think i will be getting the new test gauge until next week
..is there anything else i can check in the mean time?OH BY THE WAY!!! THANKS AGAIN FOR THE HELP!!!!!!
flareside_thunder
Florida Chapter member
- 7,812
- 246
For slaps n giggles check the voltage to the TPS key on truck not running......should be under 1.00V.
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
ok heres an update
i finally got my fuel pressure gauge in the mail today and did one test. i tested fuel pressure on start up. here is the vid.
if its not pouring out tomorrow or sunday im going to do more testing on the injectors and fuel pressure during different situations.
i know the video is really crappy. my phone lens has some scratches on it.the presure reading it is between is 40-50PSI....ill definitely get a better vid of KOEO, start up, rev, and under load so everyone can look at what its doing exactly. also when i hook the new gauge up it had a very tiny leak so i will seal the threads with some plumbers tape and do the new tests like that so i can get as accurate of a reading as possible
i finally got my fuel pressure gauge in the mail today and did one test. i tested fuel pressure on start up. here is the vid.
if its not pouring out tomorrow or sunday im going to do more testing on the injectors and fuel pressure during different situations.
i know the video is really crappy. my phone lens has some scratches on it.the presure reading it is between is 40-50PSI....ill definitely get a better vid of KOEO, start up, rev, and under load so everyone can look at what its doing exactly. also when i hook the new gauge up it had a very tiny leak so i will seal the threads with some plumbers tape and do the new tests like that so i can get as accurate of a reading as possible
Last edited:
flareside_thunder
Florida Chapter member
- 7,812
- 246
Did you??????
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
ahh crap, no i didnt actually. ill try and get that done today and report back
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
ok here is yet another update...
here is the test results of the fuel pressure system
Initial Fuel Pressure__________ PSI
_________________ KOEO------55
_________________ KOER------46
______________Snap WOT-----51
_______________2K RPM'S-----46
Fuel Pressure with Injectors Disconnected
Cyl # Disconnected_______PSI____Snap WOT
________________1-----47-48------51-52
________________2-----47-48------51-52
________________3-----47-48------51-52
________________4-----47-48------51-52
________________5-----47-48------51-52
________________6-----47-48------51-52
they were all about the same. no differences betweens injectors which was a good thing. so as for that the injectors are good, fuel pressure is good as far as i know. BUT the primary pump on the frame rail does make a lot of noise when on and doesnt sound soft and smooth...
i also tested out a few sensors
the MAP sensor was the first one i tested out
-----------in.(Hg)--------Hz (frequency)
KOEO--------0----------------156.5
KOER (idling) 21---------------102.1
the next thing i tested out real quick with only the KOEO was the O2 sensor...this got me puzzle
here is the diagram im going by
Power Ground KOEO (Volt in)
.24V ------o o------- .00V
.00V ------o
HEGO Out
the three o's are the three pins that i back probed with the KOEO....
unfortunately i i tested the TPS, IAC, and EGR solenoid but didnt write my results down
. ill get those results on here this week sometime
i also RETIMED the motor yet again just to make sure. i even called Chris on this one haha. cylinder at TDC, made sure the line on the balancer was on the 0 mark(hey Chris i did find the line by the way...very small and under the yellow marking that was there from before which is good i guess)
retimed the motor to 12 Degrees BTDC. after all this was said and done it runs about the same. no major change yet....oh i also got a new air filter since mine was pretty much CLOGGED!!....ran better with a new one and has been for a few days now.
now i still have the slight misfire
but im chugging away at finding the problem. im going to be replacing my O2 sensor being that it IS ORIGINAL for 1989!...and its cheap enough that i figure it cant hurt it any..only make it better. so we shall see.
does anyone have the specs on the EGR solenoid, the IAC and a more detailed TPS reading? thanks a lot again everyone!
here is the test results of the fuel pressure system
Initial Fuel Pressure__________ PSI
_________________ KOEO------55
_________________ KOER------46
______________Snap WOT-----51
_______________2K RPM'S-----46
Fuel Pressure with Injectors Disconnected
Cyl # Disconnected_______PSI____Snap WOT
________________1-----47-48------51-52
________________2-----47-48------51-52
________________3-----47-48------51-52
________________4-----47-48------51-52
________________5-----47-48------51-52
________________6-----47-48------51-52
they were all about the same. no differences betweens injectors which was a good thing. so as for that the injectors are good, fuel pressure is good as far as i know. BUT the primary pump on the frame rail does make a lot of noise when on and doesnt sound soft and smooth...
i also tested out a few sensors
the MAP sensor was the first one i tested out
-----------in.(Hg)--------Hz (frequency)
KOEO--------0----------------156.5
KOER (idling) 21---------------102.1
the next thing i tested out real quick with only the KOEO was the O2 sensor...this got me puzzle
here is the diagram im going by
Power Ground KOEO (Volt in)
.24V ------o o------- .00V
.00V ------o
HEGO Out
the three o's are the three pins that i back probed with the KOEO....
unfortunately i i tested the TPS, IAC, and EGR solenoid but didnt write my results down
. ill get those results on here this week sometimei also RETIMED the motor yet again just to make sure. i even called Chris on this one haha. cylinder at TDC, made sure the line on the balancer was on the 0 mark(hey Chris i did find the line by the way...very small and under the yellow marking that was there from before which is good i guess)
retimed the motor to 12 Degrees BTDC. after all this was said and done it runs about the same. no major change yet....oh i also got a new air filter since mine was pretty much CLOGGED!!....ran better with a new one and has been for a few days now.
now i still have the slight misfire
but im chugging away at finding the problem. im going to be replacing my O2 sensor being that it IS ORIGINAL for 1989!...and its cheap enough that i figure it cant hurt it any..only make it better. so we shall see.does anyone have the specs on the EGR solenoid, the IAC and a more detailed TPS reading? thanks a lot again everyone!
flareside_thunder
Florida Chapter member
- 7,812
- 246
TPS like i said should be just under 1.00V. The lightning guys say it should at .98V
Skandocious
Post Whores Make Me Sick
Send a PM to Bill (subford). He's got charts of sensor values for all the sensors, different charts specific to each model and year. He should be able to help you out.
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
ok thanks ill send hom a PM. im going to try and test the TPS sensor today
- 973
- 11
now i still have the slight misfire
does anyone have the specs on the EGR solenoid, the IAC and a more detailed TPS reading? thanks a lot again everyone!
Travis, leave the 02 sensor... if it aint broke DONT fix it biggest thing ive learned with trucks our age.. just leave em be unless they actually break
89frankenford
Grabber Green Consultant
yeah i know. i need to run a fww more tests on the O2 sensor before i go and replace it.
here is another update from today. i tested the IAC, EGR Vacuum Control Solenoid, and the TPS
Throttle Position Sensor
KOEO
Power ---- O--5.17 Volts
Computer--O--1.29 Volts (Closed Throttle)
___________--4.83 Volts (WOT Throttle)
Ground----O---.15 Volts
IAC Sensor
KOEO
Unplugged from sensor
Power ----12.26 Volts
Ground----.05 Volts
Back probed when plugged in
Power -- 12.26 Volts
Ground-- 12.26 Volts
KOER
Running Temp 190 Degrees
Power -- 13.87 Volts
Ground -- 8.35 Volts
EGR Vacuum Control Solenoid
KOEO
Power -- 11.96 Volts
Ground -- 11.96 Volts
KOER
Running Temp 190 Degrees
Power -- 13.87 Volts
Ground -- 13.87 Volts
EGR Position Sensor
KOEO
-----O--------5.19 Volts
--X-----O-----.19 Volts
-----O--------.58 Volts
here is another update from today. i tested the IAC, EGR Vacuum Control Solenoid, and the TPS
Throttle Position Sensor
KOEO
Power ---- O--5.17 Volts
Computer--O--1.29 Volts (Closed Throttle)
___________--4.83 Volts (WOT Throttle)
Ground----O---.15 Volts
IAC Sensor
KOEO
Unplugged from sensor
Power ----12.26 Volts
Ground----.05 Volts
Back probed when plugged in
Power -- 12.26 Volts
Ground-- 12.26 Volts
KOER
Running Temp 190 Degrees
Power -- 13.87 Volts
Ground -- 8.35 Volts
EGR Vacuum Control Solenoid
KOEO
Power -- 11.96 Volts
Ground -- 11.96 Volts
KOER
Running Temp 190 Degrees
Power -- 13.87 Volts
Ground -- 13.87 Volts
EGR Position Sensor
KOEO
-----O--------5.19 Volts
--X-----O-----.19 Volts
-----O--------.58 Volts
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