Auto to manual transmission conversion

[ronsii]

Hi, I hope this is the right area to post this... it's the closest I could find looking through the list...

I was wondering if anyone here has ever swapped an E4OD auto out of their vehicle and replaced it with either a 4 speed or 5 speed like a T5 and if they have what all had to be changed?

What we have is a '96 F250 ex 4x4 460efi E4OD that tows a lot (and the transmission don't like that)

I have talked to people before that swapped from a manual transmission to an automatic but not the other way around...

I would guess most the big stuff would bolt right up with maybe drive shaft lengths changing but what about the clutch side of things... would you have to change the dash for the foot pedals? And also the computer or would it even mater since it wouldn't be controlling shift points or would that have to be swapped as well?

Any suggestions on this are very welcome as we are tired of putting E4OD's in 'n out not to mention the cost of the parts and upgrades to the E4OD's

Thanks.

 

[flareside_thunder]

Welcome to the site. The T5 was never made for the 460. But that doesn't mean your options are limited. Your choice of 4 speed is going to be the BorgWarner T18 and the T19. T18 being un-synchronized first and reverse gears, the T19 being opposite. Pretty much only one 5 speed option and that's the ZF in either the S42 or S47 version, either one is equally stout. Finding one for a 460 truck may prove fruitless as I have seen very few 460 trucks with a manual. One from a diesel, both IDI and 7.3 PSD, will work but holes need to be drilled/elongated as the bolt patterns are slightly different. The engine compartment firewall has the provisions for the Clutch master cylinder to be mounted. Swapping entire dashes is not necessary, just swapping the pedal assemblies, which is just removing a few bolts/nuts. You'll also need crossmembers, driveshafts (or customized shafts) and of course the master cylinder, clutch line and slave cylinder along with the flywheel and clutch etc. Now, you can use your automatic burned ECM with the standard. it CAN be done, but your engine won't run as efficiently. and certain apsects of the tuning are slightly different. But, like I said...it can be done and alot of people do do it.

 

[Fellro]

Manuals on 460s are definitely out there, have one from a 2wd (the 92 in my sig). Likely more of them than you think... Also not limited by the year, can go back as far as you want because they really didn't change. The bigger headache comes from refitting the pedals, setting up the hydraulic clutch when there is no provisions, you will want the floor him to go over the trans, and then dealing with the computer, as it reads off the trans in regards to the shifting and such. You will have a permanent check engine light if you don't address the transmission part.

 

[Skandocious]

It's also worth mentioning that the trans must come from a truck that matches yours in terms or 2wd/4wd. The 2wd transmissions have different output shafts than the 4wd versions and modifying them to change it is very difficult.

 

[Fellro]

I considered that to be obvious, but forget that it may not be to some...

 

[Skandocious]

Another small detail that can be overlooked is the starter-- that will also need to be swapped.

 

[89PSD]

Another small detail that can be overlooked is the starter-- that will also need to be swapped.

no starters are the same.

I have done both swaps.... manual to automatic, and auto to manual swaps before.,

as said, go for a zf5. there a very strong trans, you will need a manual trans crossmember, the 3 petal assembly, slave cly, hydrulic line, master cly, clutch, flywheel, throw out bearing.
But besides that, You can ither pull the carpet back, and take out the trans tunnel hump pan (held in with 10-10mm(or 7/16) bolts and replace it with one from a standard truck. So you dont have to do any guessing on cutting a hole, or just measure and cut thru everything LOL.
You do not need to swap the dash, but if you really wanted to get rid of PRND21, you can put a block off plate that came factory on every manual trans 92+ ford truck. That PNDR21 is just comes out with screws and the block off plate bolts right where the indicator use to be.... find one easly in a junk yard.
Ford made these trucks to accept ither manual or auto trucks, the bolt holes will be already drilled in the frame for both manual/auto cross members, there is already a hole for the salve cly in the firewall(it will have a metal cover with foam around it right next to the brake booster). the 3 petal assembly bolts right in, theres a clip on the inside of the trans tunnel for the hydulic line to be secured. ect.
Not to hard.
Just remeber to leave the gear indicator switch on the drivers side of the trans connected to the wiring harness and make sure that its ither in Park or Netural when you remove it- or the truck will not start... easy fix just put your finger in the white nylon hole and twist it left. (you will see what I mean when you pull it off the trans.)
And zap strap the automatic wiring harness so its out of the way and wont fall down.

Correct me if im wrong, but dont the 460 zf5s have internal slave clynders?
I know the zf5 diesel trans is external.
Also they have different ratio gears, to keep the diesel in its short rpm range. But you can get one to bolt up by drilling. But you may run into clutch issues. I would just look for a 460 trans to save headaces.
And also said, to get the truck running back 100% you will need to evenchually find a 460 manual trans computer... it connects right in.... its located right beside the Ebrake assembly.

 

[89PSD]

but the main downside is to the zf5 is there noisy!... even new. you wont break them. It may grind gears if you shift it fast or have trouble getting it into reverse but there strong! Diesel guys put over 600rwhp+/1200tq thru them no problem.

if you have the money $4000 can get you a very nice E4OD built right from a guy who only builds those.

 

[flareside_thunder]

Yes, the gear rollover is what is so dang noisy......but they are unbeatable.

 

[Fellro]

The 460 ZF is external, just like the diesel.

 

[ronsii]

Thanks for all the replies and helpful info guys And for the welcome to the site

@ flareside_thunder: Sorry, I was thinking ZF and typed T-5 for some reason(getting old??? maybe) I actually have one in my '88 F250 2WD.

@ Skandocious: Thanks I knew about the tailshafts being different and don't really want to get into changing those out but it is always and option I guess depending on availability,

@ 89PSD: My '88 460 has an external slave cyl, I have rebuilt a few E4OD's lately, the one in my '97 PSD I did I have over 3K worth of parts in but I think I have it pretty well bullet proofed(until I up the engine again ) as I put hardened shafts, all steel planetary's and extra discs and steels.

I will talk to my buddy and hit him with all the stuff we have to round up to change and see where we end up, should be a fun project if nothing else...