Urg, no crank again.

[89PSD]

Well I though i had a problem cause by welding, but it came back... I did no welding this time (older thread) and the problem came back... heres the story

I did some welding on my truck, disconnected the battery, after welding (truck sat for a day) i reconnected it and wouldnt start.
I checked the fuse-able links i could find. they were OK.
I brought the starter to a shop (its a brand new starter) it of course tested OK.
I made a new power wire from battery to starter solonid.
I replaced the starter solonid.
then tryed all that. and it didnt start. I replaced a EEC relay and it started again. Sweet!!

Now I drove the truck for 2 days with out any problems.
then yesterday morning i got in it and it wouldnt crank again... It ran normal right before i parked it. I bump started the truck (was on a slight hill) and it fired right up.

I now I made a new 2/0ga wire for the starter to solonid. (thought maybe that wire was toast). But still the truck will not crank over, even with it being jumped. ideas??

The ground wires are newer, but they could have a bad connection, which ill check to see.

 

[Fellro]

Manual transmission? If so (I'm guessing it is due to the bump starting) check the clutch safety switch.

 

[Alvin in AZ]

Where you at? Fill out your stuff. -------------------------------------------^

Are you done fartin' around with this thing and ready to find the problem/s yet?
Huh?

-------------------------
I'm the stupid ugly old gringo that makes a point when I see a hood open to
stop and ask if I can help. It's what I do, I can't help it, I like doing it.

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/MGI0/5898.oap?pt=N1001&ppt=C0103

Dig the analog voltmeter's leads into the battery's terminals (not the clamps)
and read the voltage...
-should be about 12 volts
-what's yours?

Have your helper start the vehicle while you watch the meter's needle...
-shouldn't drop below about 10+1/2 volts
-what'd yours drop to?
-Dropped way down = bad battery and/or starter
-(I've never found a shorted starter!)
- "how old is your battery? " -Alvin
-didn't drop at all = "open circuit" like a dirty battery clamp
-opens are easy as pie to find!
-to find an "open" move the meter leads to the battery clamps and have the
helper try starting again
-voltage drops to zero it's one or both of the clamps
-that same procedure can be used to keep moving towards the starter and
its ground cable until the voltage drops to zero then you know the "open" is
"behind you".

After the vehicle starts have your helper rev the engine so you can see the
charging system operate.
-the voltage should climb to 13 to 14 volts
-(have seen diesel double-batteries climb to about 12.8 and hold there)

Do this procedure on a good working vehicle to get a feel for it.

Alvin in AZ
ps- these things are the number-one cause of "no-starts" I've ran across...
http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/batteryclamp.jpg
...the little clamp on the big clamp has just-enough surface contact and
don't take much to make it fail. Get rid of any you got, buy real cables or
solder your own.
pps- I've done this whole procedure by myself many times but it's quicker
and better with a helper.
ppps- Even Snap-On's best battery tester can't be trusted. :/ No kidding on
that it's been argued out many times on newsgroups (before website forums)
and has continued. ...and every time that statement has been backed up.
Certain guys at auto parts places know this to be true, but most believe
the sales-pitch tho. The -best- battery tester there is, is the system the
battery is installed in, using the starter as the load. Timing is a factor see?
Because a battery acts "crazy" at the end of its life. So, to test a battery,
all that's needed is a cheap analog voltmeter and a person that knows how
to use it. LOL No kidding.

 

[TexasRho83]

I bump started the truck (was on a slight hill) and it fired right up.

But still the truck will not crank over, even with it being jumped

I really think Roger has a good point in checking the clutch safety switch!

 

[Alvin in AZ]

I really think Roger has a good point in checking the clutch safety switch!

x2 ...if by "checking" you guys mean "using a meter to test ________".

The process I outlined will find a faulty clutch safety switch (aka: starter
relay cutout switch) as a matter of course, quickly too, and no silliness.

There's two methods to go about finding electrical trouble...
1) Gambling Method- swap parts until the trouble clears-up for-you or on-you.
2) Meter Method- certain, quick and straight forward way to find the actual
-real- problem/s and repair and/or replace those parts.

Seems like the first method is used about 99% of the time for automotive
electrical trouble shooting. Aren't we supposed to be the "smart guys"?

Alvin in AZ

 

[Fellro]

Checking involves using test methods of some kind, whether it be a meter, test light, jumper wire, what have you, but I also am not into throwing parts at it. I hate it when the factory manuals even say to swap parts, so it is no wonder there are many people do that, even the tech writers/engineers that build the stuff think that way.

 

[Alvin in AZ]

Checking involves using test methods of some kind, whether it be a meter,
test light, jumper wire, what have you, but I also am not into throwing parts
at it. I hate it when the factory manuals even say to swap parts, so it is no
wonder there are many people do that, even the tech writers/engineers that
build the stuff think that way.

Cool.

The one place that it's understandable was on the old Dura-Spark systems
since there wasn't a way to test those the way they needed to be tested.

But then the swap was only to be done -after- the system was thoroughly
checked out using-a-meter to be sure the new swapped-in ignition module
wasn't going to be ruined too.

Alvin in AZ

 

[89PSD]

hey thanks for the help, i got it running!

Turns out it was a bad connection on the + side terminal... Yea i know... DOHH, The first time not starting I made a new wire for the positive battery post to starter solonid ternminal, then replaced the EEC relay which was the problem.

But that new wire I made Had a larger lug that pushed off from the positive terminal and preventing the clamp of to make a full wrap around connection, which was the problem(I never really looked at the connection, i just went by how tight the nut got). So i guess driving around made it just not enough contact area to start. But shes fixed and starts a little faster now.
thanks for the help!