Codes 211 & 335

[Skandocious]

Hey guys-- got the check engine light the other night and I'm lookin' for some help. When I first scanned the codes I got 3 continuous memory codes and 1 KOEO code:

Continuous Memory Codes:
211 - Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) circuit fault
212 - Loss of ignition diagnostic monitor signal/SPOUT circuit grounded
332 - Insufficient EGR flow detected

Key on/Engine off Code:
335 - EGR sensor circuit voltage higher or lower than expected during self-test

Codes 211 & 212 had my scratching my head, so I started with the EGR stuff. For 332 I removed the EGR and cleaned it out with some carb cleaner. I sucked on the vac spout to open and close the switch while my brother sprayed carb cleaner through both ends. From what I could see it looked pretty clean to start with but who knows... As for the code 335, I was a little confused because I just replaced my EGR sensor with a new Ford part about 2-3 years ago, and it wasn't cheap.

So I reinstalled my EGR and cleared the codes before heading home to Davis (1+ hour drive). This morning I checked the codes again and after driving the truck for over an hour it's down to two codes:


Continuous memory:
211 - Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) circuit fault

KOEO:
335 - EGR sensor circuit voltage higher or lower than expected during self-test


Do I need to throw parts at it or do these codes generally signify a failure somewhere else? The strange thing about the EGR sensor code is that it's failing during the self-test, even when the truck isn't running. As for the 211 code, the only thing I could come up with is that maybe my Superchips chip is playing games with the computer... Anyone well versed with these EEC-IV computers know if a chip might affect my PIP? Any ideas?

 

[surewhynot]

I told you what to do, but you refuse to tear it apart and throw a carb on it.

 

[95F350XL]

Carbs stinks, I like EFI better. Maybe where u guys are Carb is fine when its warm out. When its cold they dont like it so well. Ask my bro with the 86 F250. Stupid choke doesnt work now. You have to do what I told u, fix ur vac leak, and then see if your gettin vac to the EGR, was the passage clogged in the intake when you had the valve off?

When the newer fords get that code its the DPFE, does ur truck have that? If u dont know differental pressure feedback sensor, reads the high and low pressure in the EGR pipe, so high when EGR is closed, and Low when open. SD trucks dont have it, maybe MAF does?

EDIT, thats for ur 332 code.

335 is prob ur sensor gone again. Id get a cheap standard 1 for it.

 

[Skandocious]

Carbs stinks, I like EFI better. Maybe where u guys are Carb is fine when its warm out. When its cold they dont like it so well. Ask my bro with the 86 F250. Stupid choke doesnt work now. You have to do what I told u, fix ur vac leak, and then see if your gettin vac to the EGR, was the passage clogged in the intake when you had the valve off?

I didn't think to look into the damned passage until after I reattached the valve. I was too focused on the valve itself

When the newer fords get that code its the DPFE, does ur truck have that? If u dont know differental pressure feedback sensor, reads the high and low pressure in the EGR pipe, so high when EGR is closed, and Low when open. SD trucks dont have it, maybe MAF does?

Yeah I did a LOT of reading about the DPFE earlier today. And yes my truck does have a DPFE-- that's the "egr sensor" that I said I replaced in my first post. Though EGR sensor isn't really the correct term. The older terms have a position sensor mounted top of the EGR valve that reads the position of the valve-- my truck doesn't have that sensor. It has the EGR valve, the DPFE sensor, and the EVR (EGR vacuum regulator). I've got a pretty intimate understanding of the whole system after reading for a couple hours earlier. And from what I saw people saying, the DPFE has a pretty high failure rate and generally anytime you get EGR codes on these trucks it's almost always a bad DPFE. And if you read the 335 code on FFI, it says "PFE or DPFE sensor voltage out of Self-Test range.", whereas my codes manual just says "EGR sensor". So yeah at this point is sounds like the DPFE is the problem... Great, expensive part [/QUOTE]

 

[95F350XL]

I think we pay like 20 bucks for that from my parts store, dont buy motorcraft, there parts are just junk, just us the brand "Standard" We use them, and never have had probs after.

 

[Skandocious]

Aluminum or plastic? Because I've seen both for that part (DPFE).

 

[95F350XL]

Either or, it dont matter. Rock auto got for 75 bucks. All the new Fords are plastic, the alum ones, get all crusty inside the high and low port and dont do squat.

 

[Skandocious]

Bringing this one back again... Drove the truck tonight (I've barely driven it at all since my last post), and it threw another CEL. Got home and scanned the codes... Same crap as last time:

Continuous Memory Codes:
211 - Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) circuit fault
212 - Loss of ignition diagnostic monitor signal/SPOUT circuit grounded
332 - Insufficient EGR flow detected

Key on/Engine off Code:
335 - EGR sensor circuit voltage higher or lower than expected during self-test


Only difference is that I got 1 extra code this time:

Key on/Engine off Code:
114 - Air charge temperature sensor higher or lower than expected voltage

Not sure why I'm getting that code unless it's a bad sensor... Again, KOEO code so the sensor was sending bad signals AS I was running the self test.

With the EGR codes coming back again I'm thinking I need to replace the DPFE, thoughts? Should I grab an ACT sensor while I'm at it? I'm assuming they're cheap cuz they're real basic.

 

[95F350XL]

Yea simple to change, might as well. Pip is in the dizzy aint it?

 

[Skandocious]

Yeah I'm wondering if those ignition codes have to do with my chip. Like maybe they just always get thrown if you install a chip. I'm gonna take the chip out when I get some time and see if the codes go away. Sucks cuz I have to remove the plastic wheel well guard to get the computer out

You think the DPFE is for sure my issue on the EGR stuff? I think it is but the cheapest I can find is around $75-80

 

[95F350XL]

Put vacuum to the EGR when its on the truck running, if it stalls out or stumbles very bad, then you egr system is working fine. Thats how we test it at work. Then id do the DPFE, if it doesnt stall your EGR passages are clogged, which I dont think happens on these years, as the EGR passage is very big in the intake.

 

[Skandocious]

Good advice, I'll try that this weekend. Thanks Chris.

 

[Late Model Man]

I too have the 211 code (which by itself does not throw the CEL) along with very intermittent stumbling/stalling and here's the fix-

I haven't fixed it yet but when it stalls and won't restart I jiggle that bundle of wires and it'll fire up every time.

It will throw a 211 code LONG before it gets worse enough to have stalling problems.

 

[Skandocious]

I haven't noticed any drivability issues with mine so I'm hoping the chip was what was throwing that code. I took the chip out yesterday and I'll drive it a bit and scan the codes again.

 

[Skandocious]

Well the code came back so the chip wasn't the culprit.

And Rick that image just showed up for me for the first time, I didn't see it before. So I just read through that TSB and I think I'll perform the steps tomorrow.

I'll report back when I'm done.

 

[Skandocious]

Well I performed the steps in the TSB. It asked me to pull back a bunch of convoluted tubing and electrical tape to expose some wires and check for exposed contacts on said wires. Well I pulled everything off and found the wires it was talking about but everything looked great, so I taped it all back up, ran it for a minute, shut her down and pulled the codes... 211 again Any other ideas? What exactly is the PIP circuit for?



Oh and by the way-- Trista's at work so Rob got to help his old man with the truck

 

[Skandocious]

Did some more research about this 211 code and found people on other forums with a similar problem. It sounds like I need to replace the stator/PIP sensor/Hall Effect Switch (it has a bunch of different names) inside of the distributor. Almost everyone is saying it's just easier to replace the whole distributor.. $200 for a Motorcraft dist. on RockAuto

Thoughts?


Also-- does my truck have a TFI (thick film ignition) module? Is that just another name for the ICM (ignition control module) mounted near my PCM on the driverside fender?

 

[Skandocious]

Looks like I can get a new stator for around $40 but I run the risk of damaging my distributor gear while disassembling it... That'd save me $150 though.... Hmmmmmm....

 

[emtzach]

im in this a bit late but how many miles on the old distributer? i only ask because if its got some age she may already be walking a bit and by the time you get torn down reassembled etc it may just be worth having put in a newr one jmo tho

 

[Skandocious]

In the giant stack of receipts I got from the PO, distributor is not one of them... So I'm assuming this is a factory distributor which means ~115k miles on it. Minus the cap and rotor of course, which I replaced about 20k miles ago.

From what I see in the diagram below, there aren't really very many parts that can "wear out"... Besides the stator and maybe the teeth on the gear getting worn or the base housing cracking... It's a fairly basic design with not a lot of parts....